What does death reveal about who we really are?

This week I'm joined by Professor Douglas Davies, Director of the Centre for Death and Life Studies at Durham University and one of the world's leading scholars of death, ritual, and belief. His work spans decades and disciplines — from the anthropology of funerals to digital legacy, from woodland burial to the theology of grief — and his central conviction runs through all of it: the dead live within us, and recognising that can help us live better.

We talk about the ways death strips away the myth of the self-made individual, revealing that we are fundamentally relational beings — shaped by the people, places, and memories we carry. Along the way, we cover the full arc of how societies and individuals make meaning in the face of mortality.

We talk about:

• Résumé virtues versus eulogy virtues — and why the gap between them matters
• The concept of "dividual" personhood, and why the idea of a fixed, separate self breaks down when we actually look at how people live and grieve
• How grief theory has shifted from letting go to continuing bonds — and what that means for how we mourn
• Why funerals work: their role as social containers for emotion and meaning
• The rise of celebration of life services and direct cremation, and what those trends tell us
• Woodland burial, the scattering of ashes, and the pull of relational places
• Dying alone, shame, dignity, and what COVID forced us to confront about community
• Digital death platforms, online memorials, and why offline ritual still does something different
• New body disposition options, including alkaline hydrolysis
• Pets, suicide, and the ways love complicates every tidy theory of grief

For further reading, Douglas's book Death, Ritual and Belief: The Rhetoric of Funerary Rites (now in its third edition) is a rich and authoritative guide to everything this conversation touches — available from Blackwell's and other independent bookshops.

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What does it mean to try to change the world — without losing yourself, or everyone else, in the process?

This week I'm joined by Anthea Lawson: activist, writer, former journalist, and campaigner who has spent three decades working on issues from the arms trade to financial secrecy. Her new book, How Not to Save the World: Doing Good Without Annoying Everyone (Oneworld, 2026), is a candid and hopeful look at the traps that well-meaning people fall into — and how to find a better way through.

We explore the hidden "save the world" script that pushes so many of us toward either frantic overwork or numb despair, and why both tend to backfire. Anthea maps out a third path — grounded in humility, relationship, and local people power — that turns out to be more effective, and more sustaining, than heroic effort alone.

We talk about:

• The two default responses when the world feels overwhelming: compulsion and shutdown
• What "script messages" are, and how unconscious patterns quietly drive activism culture
• How a genuine commitment to good can tip into righteousness that pushes people away
• Why the protest voice often fails in everyday relationships — and what listening can do instead
• How purity tests and perfectionism raise the barrier to entry and shrink movements
• Overwhelm as a structural tactic that keeps communities divided and reactive
• "I know better" dynamics, lived experience, and the legacy of class and white saviour thinking
• Why meaningful change now requires people power over individual heroics
• Antidotes: service, bridge-building, showing up without ego, and the value of genuine relationship
• Regulating the nervous system through embodiment and co-regulation
• Making space for grief — not as defeat, but as something shared that creates breathing room

How Not to Save the World is available from independent bookshops — you can order it through Bookshop.org, which supports independent booksellers directly.

Follow Anthea's writing and thinking on Substack at anthealawson.substack.com.

If you enjoyed this episode, a rating or review goes a long way — and do sign up on Substack for This Examined Life, where you'll find updates, newsletters, and reflections between episodes.

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Gavin Francis is a GP in Edinburgh, and also one of the best writers I know of on what it means to be a body moving through a life. In this conversation we got into territory I didn't quite expect — how much of modern spiritual hunger ends up in the consulting room, why a diagnosis can be both a relief and a trap, and what it actually looks like to help someone climb out of a dark period without reaching straight for a prescription.

He has a ten-point list he shares with patients in despair. It's practical without being glib, and I think it's quietly one of the most useful things in this episode.

We also talked about attention — how flow and deep engagement are being quietly eroded, what AI convenience might be costing us in terms of capability and friction, and why awe and equanimity aren't soft ideas but things that actually hold communities together.

He's thoughtful, unhurried, and genuinely humble about what medicine can and can't do. I came away with a clearer sense of what flourishing actually means — which is not the same thing as happiness, and is worth distinguishing.

If it resonates, please pass it on. You can find more conversations like this at This Examined Life — and if you'd like updates and new episodes delivered to you, sign up on Substack.

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Stephen Cave is a philosopher, writer, and Director of the Leverhulme Centre for the Future of Intelligence at the University of Cambridge. His work sits at the intersection of philosophy, religion, ethics, and technology, exploring humanity’s oldest questions about death, meaning, immortality, and what it means to live well in a rapidly changing world.

Before entering academia, Stephen worked as a diplomat for the British Foreign Office. He is an internationally recognised public philosopher whose research and writing examine how human beings confront mortality, and how emerging technologies, especially artificial intelligence, are reshaping those responses.

In this conversation, we explore why the awareness of death may be the defining feature of being human, and how our attempts to escape mortality continue to shape culture, religion, science, and modern technological ambition.

In This Episode We Explore:

• The evolutionary roots of the survival instinct paired with a uniquely human awareness of death
• Terror Management Theory and why immortality beliefs appear across cultures
• Religion, legacy, fame, and technology as competing “immortality stories”
• The wisdom tradition: gratitude for the sheer unlikeliness of being alive
• Serving others as an antidote to self-focused mortality anxiety
• Presence, mindfulness, and practices that reduce future-oriented fear
• Near-death experiences — and how naturalistic explanations can still preserve meaning
• Why living “forever” might collapse identity, values, and purpose
• Life-expectancy myths, real medical progress, and the limits of longevity optimism
• AI and biological technologies accelerating anti-ageing research
• Modern abundance alongside a growing crisis of meaning
• Population pressure, carrying capacity, and what it would take for longer lives to go well

Stephen Cave’s Books

• Immortality: The Quest to Live Forever and How It Drives Civilization
  A widely acclaimed philosophical exploration of humanity’s enduring attempts to overcome death.
• Should You Choose to Live Forever?
  A concise introduction to one of philosophy’s most provocative questions: would immortality actually be good for us?
• AI Narratives: A History of Imaginative Thinking about Intelligent Machines (with Kanta Dihal)
  An exploration of how stories, myths, and cultural imagination shape our understanding of artificial intelligence.

Podcast Links:

www.examined-life.com

https://thisexaminedlife.substack.com/

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Mortality: Threat or Catalyst? A Conversation with Dr. Kathryn Mannix

In this episode of The Examined Life, Kenny Primrose is in conversation with writer, speaker, and retired palliative care physician Dr. Kathryn Mannix about whether mortality is experienced as a threat or a catalyst for living. Mannix describes how early fear and resentment of death drew her to caring for dying patients, what she observed as medical abandonment, and how nurses taught her that the most important thing at the bedside is “how you are.” She argues that modern culture has lost “death literacy,” fueling fears shaped by Hollywood depictions and that talking about death through storytelling helps people to understand ordinary dying and what to expect. The discussion covers loss of control, end-of-life “audits,” regret as a processed, safer place than rage or shame, emotional literacy, and companionship that makes space for distress. Mannix suggests accepting finitude can clarify values and cultivate gratitude.

00:00 Mortality As Catalyst

01:27 Meet Dr Mannix

04:01 Threat Or Catalyst

04:32 Learning To Be Present

11:22 Magical Thinking Fears

16:56 What Dying Looks Like

23:11 End Of Life Audit

27:38 Rethinking Regret

32:25 Regrets and Joys

34:05 Regret as Wisdom

35:01 Emotional Literacy Work

38:35 Guilt Shame Reframing

40:50 Self Compassion Voices

43:33 Holding Space Culture

48:52 Telling the Story

51:22 End of Life Audit

53:28 Death Catalyst Gratitude

58:59 Closing Reflections

Relevant Links:

https://www.kathrynmannix.com/

www.examined-life.com

https://thisexaminedlife.substack.com/

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BJ Miller on Loss, Meaning, and Learning to Feel

In this conversation, Kenny Primrose speaks with palliative care physician BJ Miller, co-founder of Mettle Health, about grief—not as an interruption to life, but as one of its central experiences.

Rather than treating grief as something that happens only after death, Miller suggests it is a constant human condition: the emotional response to loving things that inevitably change, fade, or disappear. The problem, he argues, is that modern culture is profoundly grief-illiterate. We rush people toward closure, reward emotional stoicism, and teach one another to avoid feeling too much.

Drawing on his own life—including a catastrophic electrical accident at age 19 and the later death of his sister, Miller explores how grief shapes identity, attention, relationships, and even politics. When grief is denied, it often reappears disguised as anger, grievance, blame, or division. When felt honestly, however, grief reconnects us to meaning, deepens aliveness, and enlarges our capacity to live well.

The conversation ranges from personal loss to healthcare reform, from daily mortality practices to the healing role of beauty and nature at the end of life.

In This Episode

• Why grief is not exceptional but universal
• How emotional avoidance creates “grief illiteracy”
• The pressure to perform strength—and its hidden costs
• What patients at the end of life teach about living
• How grief transforms into anger, grievance, and polarization
• Loss as a doorway to presence and gratitude
• The importance of rituals and communal containers for mourning
• Why medicine often treats death as failure
• Practicing mortality as a path to meaning
• Beauty, nature, and tenderness as forms of medicine

Key Ideas

Grief as Love Continuing
Grief reveals what mattered. Rather than diminishing life, it clarifies it.

Grief vs. Grievance
Unfelt grief frequently becomes blame, resentment, or political division.

Learning to Feel
Emotional literacy—pausing before reacting, tolerating discomfort—is both personally healing and socially protective.

Rituals Matter
Modern societies have lost many shared practices that help people metabolize loss. We must rediscover or reinvent them.

Rethinking Healthcare
End-of-life care should prioritize meaning, beauty, and connection—not simply the postponement of death.

Website - www.examined-life.com

Substack - https://thisexaminedlife.substack.com

Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@ExaminedLifePodcast

BJ's TED talk - https://www.ted.com/talks/bj_miller_what_really_matters_at_the_end_of_life

Other resources on Grief - https://edition.cnn.com/all-there-is-anderson-cooper

Mettle Health - https://www.mettlehealth.com/

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Learning from Loss with Dr. Lucy Hone

How do you survive the unthinkable? When resilience researcher Dr. Lucy Hone lost her 12-year-old daughter in a tragic accident, she didn't just study the science of grief—she had to live it. In this episode, Lucy joins Kenny Primrose to share the practical, evidence-based tools that help us oscillate between mourning and living, and what we can learn about life in the wake of loss.

In This Episode:

In this new series on grief and mortality, we explore why the "stages of grief" model often fails us and what actually works instead. Dr. Lucy Hone discusses her journey from the University of Pennsylvania’s resilience program to the frontlines of her own personal tragedy.

Key Topics Discussed:

• The Myth of "Bouncing Back": Why we need a more pragmatic definition of resilience.
• The 3 Habits of Resilient Grievers: Simple, actionable shifts in attention that can change your trajectory.
• The "Helping or Harming" Test: A vital tool for psychological flexibility.
• The Jigsaw Metaphor: How to rebuild your life when the old pieces no longer fit.
• Hidden Grief: Understanding "non-death" losses and how to process them.

About Lucy:

Dr. Lucy Hone is a best-selling author, TED speaker, and co-director of the New Zealand Institute of Wellbeing & Resilience. Her work has been published in The Journal of Positive Psychology and featured in The Washington Post, BBC, and The Guardian.

Resources Mentioned:

• Book: Resilient Grieving: How to Find Your Way Through a Devastating Loss
• New Book: How Will I Ever Get Through This? (On hidden and non-death grief)
• TED Talk: The Three Secrets of Resilient People

Connect with The Examined Life:

• Host: Kenny Primrose
• Website: www.examined-life.com
• Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@ExaminedLifePodcast
• Follow & Subscribe on substack: https://thisexaminedlife.substack.com/
• Support the series - buymeacoffee.com/kennyprimrose

If you found this episode helpful, please leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify—it helps others find these conversations.

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A short trailer for the forthcoming season where we explore mortality, immortality, loss, grief and finding meaning in the wake of them.

In the above clip you'll hear snippets from Lucy Hone, BJ Miller, Kathryn Mannix and Victor Strecher - with other episodes to follow. Subscribe and stay tuned for the forthcoming episodes, and sign up to This Examined Life on Substack to receiving updates and related essays to your inbox - This Examined Life | kenneth primrose | Substack

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