Tony and Steve welcome Aric Bostick, keynote speaker, former classroom teacher, professional crowd-energizer, and the man Steve publicly credits for telling him to get on a stage when he was just some guy with a book idea and a lot of enthusiasm. Aric brings the science of attachment theory out of the therapy room and drops it straight into your org chart. You'll learn why people leave companies that pay more to work somewhere they feel seen. Why your resting face is already sending a message to your team (it's probably not the one you want). Why "soft skills" is the wrong name for the hardest thing most managers will never learn.

For the record, Tony has never made a mistake.

Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven "Big Deal" Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the Books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast
Learn more about Dyno Outfitters at: https://www.utahviaferrata.com/
Learn more about MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/

Steve and Tony attended the Fuel HR conference on May 14, 2026. They talked the EEOC's case against the NY Times, diversity, and interviewed several attendees. The most pertinent piece of advice they got from the conference is "If you're going to discriminate, don't advertise and document it."

Note: There were two interviews that were lost due to computer and sound issues. We apologize to those two people and will get them back on the show soon.

On a more positive note, Steve and Tony introduced a lot of people to LimeRickys.

A CEO returns to his struggling startup, looks around at the wreckage, and decides the HR team is the problem. He fires them. All of them. Then tells the world about it at a conference. Tony and Steve have opinions. Surprising, nuanced, occasionally loud opinions, and they're not entirely on the side you'd expect. In between the Star Wars tangents and Tony's deep philosophical feelings about performance improvement plans, the guys also tackle AI: what most HR professionals are doing wrong, why Reddit is a terrifying foundation for legal advice, and how to actually use these tools without accidentally torching your credibility. Fifty episodes in, and the chaos has never been more educational.

Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven “Big Deal” Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast

Learn more about our New sponsor at: https://www.utahviaferrata.com/
Learn more about our sponsor MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Lean more about Jobs for America's Graduates (JAG) at: https://jag.org/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/
Learn more about the Thrive Life Project: https://www.thrivelifeproject.org/
The newest book mentioned on the podcast: The Bus Has No Driver: https://rb.gy/rqocj5

Tony and Steve welcome Derik Clark — Army counterintelligence veteran, body language expert, and apparently a crowd favorite on par with Steve (high praise). Derik breaks down his HEED framework for reading nonverbal cues in HR investigations and job interviews, and why the thing you think you're seeing (lying) is almost never the thing you're actually seeing (discomfort). He also shares the true story of an Iraqi weapons smuggler who had perfect body language… until someone asked him where he was getting his money. Tony connects the dots to workplace investigations, written warnings, and why 80% of every workplace conflict story is actually the same from both sides. Steve didn't know Rocky Raccoon was a song, which tells you everything you need to know.

Learn more about Derik Clark at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/derikclark/
Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven "Big Deal" Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the Books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast
Learn more about MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/

Derik Clark is a veteran counterintelligence officer who served in the US Army and now works as an HR business partner and consultant. He's an expert interrogator that specializes in how to read people and the room.

Derik's HEED Framework:
Hide
Escape
Ease
Defend
(How people react when they feel uncomfortable.)

Tony and Steve kick off the show in full Star Wars mode — it's May the Fourth, Steve spent $19.77 on themed donuts from Lehi Bakery, and the great AT-AT pronunciation debate is finally settled (hint: Steve is wrong). The real guest of honor is Albert Foster, founder of Express Evaluations. The episode digs deep into one of HR's most stubbornly unsolved problems: why performance evaluations, invented in the 1950's, still look almost exactly the same today. Albert lays out a compelling case for why most companies are doing evaluations wrong. From the one-size-fits-all form that means nothing to the employee who fills it out, to the trap of asking "how can you improve?" Finally, how does Steve use Vader's origin story to tie everything together at the end? Tune in to find out!

Listen for Opportunity knocking in this episode.

Learn more about Express Evaluations at: https://www.expressevaluations.com/
Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven “Big Deal” Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast
Learn more about our sponsor MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Lean more about Jobs for America's Graduates (JAG) at: https://jag.org/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/
Learn more about the Thrive Life Project: https://www.thrivelifeproject.org/

Albert Foster (MHR, SPHR) is an HR professional and the Founder and CEO of Express Evaluations. His passion in HR is to help employees find joy in their employment and to help employers retain their hard-earned talent. Albert earned a master’s in human resources in 2012 from Utah State and has been in the HR world for the past 15 years as both an HR consultant and an HR director. While working as the HR director of a special service district with about 500 employees he was tasked with finding a new performance management system. After several months of searching it became clear that a product didn’t exist in the current market that encompassed both the flexibility and affordability for his company, so he decided to create his own. Albert considers himself to be an avid mountain biker, marginal golfer, and recently converted ice bather.

We're not choked up, you're choked up. Wow! The guys spend an afternoon interviewing students at JAG's (Jobs for America's Graduates) National Career Development Conference (NCDC). In this episode, you'll hear how lives changed, doors opened, and how a group of young people is making the most of their opportunities, all because of JAG.

A list of Guests Interviewed: Bailey, Jamarcus, Gabe, Madison, Caleb, James Jackson, and Lane Faulkner.

Video of Steve getting an award (at Appx 1.48:10) here: https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?ref=watch_permalink&v=2093927045342003&rdid=3ziMBc5LK1ucOUqR ...Oh, and Johnny C Taylor spoke too.

Learn more about JAG at: https://jag.org/
Learn More about Money Moves University at: https://moneymovesuniversity.com/
Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven "Big Deal" Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/

Steve and Tony talk international remote workers and retention methods with Troy Blanchard from ZConnect. Steve talks about implementing COVID early and often. Tony talks about Ford Verses Ferrari and how the bureaucracy so prominent in that movie was real... and was probably the fault of the CEO. And finally, Tony introduces everybody to the "Slug Line" in DC.

Learn more about Troy Blanchard: https://www.linkedin.com/in/trblanchard/
Learn more about Zconnect at: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zconnect-global-outsourcing/posts/?feedView=all or https://zconnect.biz/
Learn more about the Shingo Model at: https://shingo.org/shingo-model/ or at: https://huntsman.usu.edu/mba/shingo-online-mba
Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven "Big Deal" Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the Books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast
Learn more about MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/

Troy is the co-owner of ZConnect, a company that helps U.S. businesses scale by connecting them with highly qualified remote professionals across Latin America and other parts of the world. With decades of experience in operations, leadership development, outsourcing, business development, sales, and strategic growth, Troy is passionate about helping companies solve complex business challenges, improve efficiency, and build strong cross-border teams. He enjoys bringing people together in a way that creates value for both the client and the professionals supporting them. Through ZConnect, Troy helps companies grow more profitably by developing and integrating remote teams that support key business functions while allowing leaders to stay focused on growth, service, and long-term success.

Tony and Steve break down parts of SHRM's annual State of the Workplace report, but only after venturing into stories of strange women playing footsies with Steve on a cruse. Who is the most optimistic that employers are meeting the needs of their employees? Employees, HR professionals, and HR Executives, are all in agreement that the second biggest need n the workplace is...? Want to know what is happening now in HR? This is your episode.

Find the study at: https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/research/state-of-the-workplace-summary-and-report/2026-sowp-full-report

Join us at Fuel HR on May 14. Learn more at: https://hracu.starchapter.com/meetinginfo.php?id=88&ts=1744305292

Learn more about Fantastic Tony Benjamin at: https://www.thegrangellc.com/
Learn more about Steven “Big Deal” Smith at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/
Learn more about the books mentioned on the podcast at: https://thehiringtreebook.com/hr-life-podcast
Learn more about our sponsor MegastarHR at: https://www.megastarhr.com/
Lean more about Jobs for America's Graduates (JAG) at: https://jag.org/
Learn more about Pucks for Autism at: https://www.pucksforautism.com/

Join us at Fuel HR on May 14. Learn more at: https://hracu.starchapter.com/meetinginfo.php?id=88&ts=1744305292