This week on OverProof, I sit down with Timo Janse — founder of Dutch Courage Cocktail Bar in Amsterdam, creator of the Perfect Serve Bar Show, organiser of Amsterdam Cocktail Week, and the man who used his bar opening savings to build a national bar show instead because nobody else was going to do it.

Timo's path into hospitality started as a side job while studying economics — a dive bar on weekends, then a boutique hotel bar where he showed up as a temp and ended up managing the place within weeks. From there, nearly a decade behind the stick at Door 74, Amsterdam's legendary speakeasy, before finally getting the keys to his own venue — two weeks before COVID hit.

He talks about what it took to actually open Dutch Courage: the false starts, the asbestos ceiling nobody mentioned until they were ready to sign, the banks that wouldn't touch him until he'd already survived five years without them, and the insurance broker who told him not to bother thinking about a pension. He also gets into what it looked like to run three bars, split from a business partner the right way, and come out the other side with one venue, more clarity, and a sign on his wall that says nobody's ever gotten smarter from a meeting.

And there's a guest shift story. I won't ruin it. Just know it involves a cucumber, a three-floor bar where every single staff member was on their first day, and Timo having to be physically dragged out at the end of his shift.

I sit down with Jason Williams — Director at Housemade Hospitality in Sydney, spirits evangelist turned venue operator, and the man with his face on a gin that became the official pour of the Singapore Sling.

Jason's path into hospitality was deliberate from the start — Eagle Boys Pizza at 13, a Hyatt Regency resort, nightclubs in Brisbane, cocktail bars in Melbourne, and eventually a Group Bars Manager role at Keystone before getting headhunted to Singapore to run the bar consultancy arm of Proof and Company. Over eight years, he worked on some of the most significant bar openings in Asia Pacific — Raffles, Atlas, a $500M Four Seasons in Seoul — before returning to Sydney to co-found Housemade Hospitality with his business partners.

Housemade now operates 13 venues, including four across the heritage-listed Hinchcliffe House at Circular Quay. They hit five years this year. One of those venues had to close. Jason talks about that too.

We get into what scaling a group actually costs you — your attention, your relationships, your ability to taste every cocktail in every bar. He shares where he thinks bar consultancy is heading, why he thinks most people are using AI like embarrassing Facebook posts from 2010, and what it means to miss your best friend's wedding for a bar opening and know, without much doubt, that you'd probably do it again.

I interview Zara Madrusan — founder of The Everleigh, Heartbreaker, Everleigh Bottling Co, Connie's Navy Strength, Ice Co, Bar Margaux, LB's Record Bar, and Bartenders Choice Consultancy, co-writer of Madrusan Cocktail Companion, and A Spot at the Bar.

Zara shares her path from studying theatre and performance in London to landing in Melbourne on a whim, walking into The Everleigh five days later, and falling completely under its spell. She describes that first visit — the waft of freshly pressed mint, the choreographed dance between bartenders and floor staff, the feeling of being transported — and knowing immediately she wanted to be part of it.

She explains how the team took her under their wing, taught her everything, and eventually handed her the keys to The Elk Room to run events. From there, her creativity sparked: test the bartender challenges, immersive concepts, and ideas borrowed from London's underground bar scene. She talks about how her theatre background shaped the way she sees hospitality and how that lens gave her permission to pitch wild ideas to a team generous enough to back them.

We also get into what it's like juggling multiple venues, how she knew she wanted this career before she knew it was even possible, and the moment her passion shifted from drinks alone to the full experience of running spaces.

Congrats on being nominated for Tales for your new book!

Find The Madrusan Cocktail Companion here: https://www.amazon.com.au/Madrusan-Cocktail-Companion-Contributions-Bartenders/dp/1761500449

Zara's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zaramadrusan/

Overproof Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/overproofff/

Dre Walters co-owns Old Mates Place and Old Loves — two bars tucked away on the fourth floor and basement of a century-old Sydney building. Getting there means riding a rickety 1920s lift or climbing narrow service stairs, but that's part of the charm.

In this conversation, Dre talks about what actually happens when you open a bar: hitting asbestos on day one of the build, losing $85,000 before you've poured a single drink, and working with a lift that's broken down for months at a time. He also shares how his background in commercial real estate helped him negotiate leases, why he walked away from seven potential sites before finding the right one, and what it took to build a rooftop bar with no money left in the budget.

We also get into the stuff people don't usually talk about — like the heartbreak of spending months on plans for a second rooftop venue, only to have council reject it at the final hurdle. And we touch on what's coming for Australian hospitality, as excise taxes push cocktail prices toward $35 and small operators figure out how to stay afloat.

If you're thinking about opening a bar, or you're already in the thick of it, this one's for you.

Ethan Phillips — coffee roaster, café owner, and one of the most quietly honest people I've spoken to on this show. Based in Hawke's Bay, Ethan has spent the last nine years building a wholesale roasting business and a café from the ground up, with very little money, a business partner who disappeared overnight, and more curveballs than most people see in a lifetime.

We talk about what it actually looks like to start a business on next to nothing — borrowing $25k to get a roastery going and $17k to open a café — and why not borrowing enough can be just as dangerous as borrowing too much. He takes me through the chaos of their first lease, a five-month battle with council, and the moment he went from saying "we don't want this space" to tripling down on the commitment in a single week.

But it's the stuff that happened after the doors opened that makes this episode. Three weeks after his first daughter was born, his business partner left under circumstances he's never spoken about publicly — until now. What followed was years of running a business solo while navigating his wife's postnatal depression, the Napier floods, Cyclone Gabrielle, the vaccine mandate, and a mental health reckoning he kept deferring until he simply couldn't anymore.

Ethan talks about the conscious decision he made to shut off his mental fitness and just survive — and what it cost him. He also talks about what's helped: two years of counselling, building the right people around him, and finding the things that genuinely switch him off (including a very niche hobby involving miniatures and strategy that I didn't see coming).

He's now stepping away from the café after eight years, passing the baton on, and heading south to build out a new roastery chapter on a six-hectare lifestyle block. He's excited. You'll understand why.

Alice Newport has been in hospitality since before it was legal for her to be in a bar.

Note: This conversation was recorded last year so some details may be out of date.

From Perth nightclubs to Christmas Island to brand ambassador for one of the biggest whiskey brands in the world — Alice's path into hospo is anything but straight, and honestly, that's what makes it so good.

In this episode we talk about what it actually takes to land a brand ambassador role, why community is more than a buzzword, and what Alice would tell her 18-year-old self arriving in Perth with no plan and a lot of nerve.

We also get into the stuff nobody really talks about — burnout, never switching off, and why loving your job this much can be both your greatest strength and your biggest challenge.

If you haven't had the pleasure of meeting Alice yet. You're going to love her.

I interview Alex about his hospitality ownership journey, which he describes as challenging, freeing, and a relentless pursuit of control — words that still ring true a decade in.
He shares his path from running plates at Cobb & Co in Hamilton to six years with the Phoenix Group, then a broken elbow, a stint at the Chateau, and a sleeping dream that led to opening Wonder Horse eight weeks later.

Alex explains how he funded his first venue on holiday payout and a loan secured against his mum's house, bought out his original business partners when the dynamic stopped working, and then joined forces with Matt and John to build Over Proof Hospitality — now nine or ten venues depending on how you count. He describes the unusual logic behind their growth: opening more venues not to chase revenue, but to create career pathways for a team that had nowhere left to go.

He also gets into the emotional reality of scaling fast; the partnership structure, dividing roles loosely across beverage, kitchen and FOH, the HR growing pains, and the cold-sweat nights wondering if it's all about to fall apart.

His key advice: know why you want to open a venue, get the doors open even if you're not ready, and treat it like it's someone else's money, because the moment you start mourning bottle rings on your bar top, you've already lost the plot.

I interview Rachel about her hospitality ownership journey, which she sums up as exciting and adventurous, shaped by changing realities after opening, including COVID and today’s tougher spending climate.

She shares her path from restaurant management to a long office-career hiatus while keeping hospitality as a side hustle, then opening Hey Palu in Edinburgh with her husband.

Rachel explains how they financed the business with savings, a small family loan, and a bank loan, how COVID forced pivots like takeaway cocktails that boosted brand awareness, and how staffing and awards followed.

She then describes opening an agave-focused second venue via a brewery lease, why it struggled (location, due diligence, rising costs, changing consumer spend), how they chose to close it, the mental toll, and the practical realities of shutting down a business.

Her key advice is to know your “why,” gain varied venue experience, talk to peers, and recognize that closing isn’t failure.

Hey Palu: https://www.heypalu.com/

Rachels Socials: https://www.instagram.com/mrs_mezcal/?hl=en

Overproof Socials: https://www.instagram.com/overproofff/?hl=en

00:00 Three Words In

00:37 Before The First Venue

02:32 Hospo Roots And Burnout

04:28 Opening From Oil And Gas05:54 Partners And The Leap

07:48 Original Vision And Menu Pivot

10:07 Buying Out A Partner

12:36 Couples Conflict And COVID Pivot

15:48 Funding And Bootstrapping

17:07 The Unicorn Venue Build

20:02 First Year And COVID Rules

23:01 Post COVID Surge And Growth

24:14 Staffing And Capacity

25:17 Thinking About Venue Two

25:27 Hunting the Right Venue

26:10 Awards and New Ambitions

26:53 Dividing Roles for Site Two

27:39 Mezcal Certification Journey

30:33 Sourcing Agave in Edinburgh

31:21 Funding and Legal Separation

32:10 When the Cracks Appeared

35:42 Deciding to Close the Bar

38:55 Burnout and Staff Impact

42:25 Closing Admin and Utilities

47:03 Advice for Future Owners

52:26 Highlights Lowlights and Edinburgh Picks

55:42 Final Lessons and Farewell