Most homeowners spend more time around their pool than in it. Which means the patio, the deck, and the gathering spaces around the water carry most of the experience. So how do you plan that space well?

In this episode, Cristian sits down with Trey Watford, lead designer at River Pools Virginia, for a practical, design-driven conversation about patio square footage. They cover the realistic averages, the dimensions behind every common gathering space, and the side-by-side comparisons that show why allocation matters more than total size. If you're planning a fiberglass pool and trying to figure out how much patio you actually need, this one's for you.

In this episode

• Why patios get underestimated and how to avoid the most common regrets • The honest average patio size, and when your needs land outside it • How much room each zone really needs (conversation, dining, fire pit, hot tub, grill, outdoor kitchen) • Minimum walkway widths around the pool for safety and comfort • Practical ways to visualize your space at home before signing anything • How to phase your patio over time without ending up with a patchwork look

About Trey Watford

Trey Watford is the lead designer at River Pools Virginia. He brings a Virginia Tech background in landscape architecture and years of hands-on experience designing high-end outdoor living spaces around fiberglass pools.

Watch the video version on YouTube to see Trey's design walkthroughs on screen. Search The Pool Guides Podcast.

Start planning your pool at riverpoolsandspas.com.

Catch the wave.

Most homeowners plan the pool and figure out the outdoor living space later. That's the mistake. In this episode, landscape architect Trey Watford, lead designer at River Pools Virginia, walks you through the design process from discovery to final plan, so you can approach your own project with confidence no matter who you work with.

Trey covers the questions every homeowner should ask themselves before a designer ever shows up, why site analysis is the most underrated part of the process, what a $250K–$300K backyard project actually includes, and how to bring that number down without losing what matters most.

Whether you're early in your research or already speaking with builders, this episode will give you a clearer picture of what great backyard design looks like, and what questions to ask to make sure you get it.

Topics covered:

• Where the design process actually begins (it's not where you think)
• The "dot connecting" method for deeply understanding your backyard vision
• Site analysis, elevation readings, and why skipping this step is costly
• Professional designer vs. order taker - what's the real difference?
• Live design walkthrough of a real River Pools project
• Budget reality: what drives costs up, and how to bring them down
• Where to start if you want to begin planning tomorrow

Resources mentioned: riverpoolsandspas.com — pool type selector, shape and size tool, and pool cost calculator

If you live in a region where winter temperatures regularly drop below freezing, choosing the right type of swimming pool is more complicated than it might seem.

In northern climates like Wisconsin, frost can reach several feet into the ground, and freeze–thaw cycles can create pressure on pool structures both from the surrounding soil and from the water inside the pool itself.

In this episode of The Pool Guides Podcast, Cristian Shirilla sits down with Michael Bowers of Pool Pros Wisconsin, a builder with nearly 30 years of experience installing pools in one of the coldest parts of the United States.

Together they explore how the three primary pool types — vinyl liner pools, fiberglass pools, and concrete pools — perform when exposed to harsh winter conditions.

Michael shares firsthand insights about frost depth, groundwater pressure, installation best practices, and the winter maintenance steps that can prevent costly damage.

If you're planning a pool in a colder region, this conversation will help you understand what really matters when selecting a pool that can stand up to harsh winters and deep freezes.

• How harsh winters affect swimming pool structures
• Why frost depth and freeze–thaw cycles matter when installing a pool
• The pros and cons of vinyl liner pools in colder climates
• Why fiberglass pools are often well suited for freeze–thaw environments
• How concrete pools can be engineered to withstand cold climates
• The role groundwater pressure plays in pool stability
• The importance of proper installation and drainage
• Why winter water level management can prevent structural damage

Michael Bowers
Owner, Pool Pros Wisconsin

Michael Bowers has nearly three decades of experience installing swimming pools in Wisconsin, where deep frost lines and harsh winters create unique challenges for pool construction. His expertise in cold-climate pool installations provides homeowners with practical guidance for choosing the right pool and ensuring long-term durability.

The Pool Guides Podcast helps homeowners make confident decisions about choosing and installing a swimming pool.

Hosted by Cristian Shirilla of River Pools, each episode features experienced builders and industry professionals sharing real-world knowledge about pool types, costs, installation practices, and backyard planning.

The goal is simple: give homeowners the information they need to make smart decisions before construction ever begins.